Governors are alphas and omegas in their states – Ngilari

Bala James Ngilari has a rare experience in politics. Apart from being a lawyer and a former member of the House of Reps, he is one of the few deputy governors to rise to the position of a governor. The dramatic way it happened also stands him out as the only deputy governor whose alleged […]

Bala James Ngilari has a rare experience in politics. Apart from being a lawyer and a former member of the House of Reps, he is one of the few deputy governors to rise to the position of a governor. The dramatic way it happened also stands him out as the only deputy governor whose alleged ‘resignation’ from office served as a catalyst for him to succeed his boss. Having experienced all there is in governance, he explains to Weekend Trust why governors exercise so much powers and what can be done to make sure they do not overstep their boundaries.

 

It appears almost everything revolves around governors these days. You served as governor of Adamawa state. How powerful are governors in Nigeria? 

Well, thank you very much. I will say briefly that governors are as powerful as the organic law, which is the Constitution, has made them to be because if you look at the 1999 Constitution, the office of the governor of a state has been created and all the executive powers are vested in him, to the exclusion of any other person. 

And it says specifically in terms of exercising executive powers that it is vested in whoever is the governor at any point in time.

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You know we practice the Federal System of government which we borrowed from America. And so, even though in strict legal theory, the three arms must interface, they are supposed to be independent of each other; the executive, the legislature, and the judiciary.

But in practice, that distinction that exists in theory doesn’t exist in the world of reality and primarily because only the governor has the power to sign and order money belonging to the state to be spent in any particular way.

Yes, there’s a point in the budgetary provision where the governor submits his appropriation or his request to the house of assembly. But you see, the final thing is that it’s not the House or the speaker who can incur expenditure in terms of ordering that money be paid for anything.

At the end of that imaginary tripod, the governor is at the top. And his decision is final. And this is because that is the power that is vested in him by the constitution. But as one elected by the people, the governor is supposed to exercise those powers bearing in mind that he’ll be accountable somewhere, either and particularly at the end of his tenure.

But until you leave office, the governor is the alpha and omega because of the immunity he enjoys. That also goes to show you that in most cases, in 99% of cases, those who suffer after they leave office in terms of being investigated and being arraigned or prosecuted, are mostly governors because the deputy governor has no power to incur any expenditure.

 

Where do you place this concept of first-line charge where certain arms like the judiciary are supposed to be financially independent?

Is there any such thing in reality? Maybe under the recent amendment, otherwise, even if you have a first-line charge, it does not operate in a vacuum? After budgetary provision is debated and approved by the House, somebody still has to sign some documents before what falls into first-line charge gets to you and the person who has that power is the governor.

 

Is that why governors are addressed as “executive govenors?”

That’s a good one. Let me demonstrate here with my experience in government. As a deputy governor, I had no executive powers because the deputy governor has no executive powers under the Constitution. The deputy governor by law is a recipient of whatever power or whatever assignment his boss, the governor, gives him. The Constitution has stripped him of any executive power. Yes, there are areas that he’s supposed to supervise, but that is subject to the overriding power of the governor.

Because of this, at functions, the protocol department, always makes the mistake of introducing the governor as the executive governor.

When I was in office, I tell them, no, I am not an executive governor. I became governor by operation of the Constitution after my boss was removed and I was sworn in as governor. I said, no, I’m a lawyer. There is no such thing, nomenclature in the Constitution as executive governor of a state.

 

Apart from controlling the expenditure, governors solely decide who heads the judiciary, legislature; local government councils; party chairmen in their states. Is it right and if not, how do you think this can be corrected?

You see, ours is an evolving democracy, the Constitution is not a perfect document and this is why from time-to-time amendments are done and amendments should be the product of public hearings. It is not something anybody can sit and say this is iron cast solution to these things. A lot depends on the attitude of the person in office. For instance, throughout my six-seven month’s tenure as governor, I said I will comply with the dictates of the law. whatever is to the other arms give it to them. Bring it, I sign, give it to them, provided there are funds to meet these needs because they are an arm of government by themselves. I never for once said ‘no’ because that is the kind of rapport and understanding that should exist between these three arms of government. But some, for whatever reason decide to act differently.

 

Some would say assuming you stayed longer in office you will also join the bandwagon.

You know it is about the individual. You know this is where the spiritual part of all these things comes into play as far as I’m concerned. Imagine in a state of four, five million people, God decided to prop you up to be the chief executive. First you have to appreciate this Almighty God, you are not the best, there are many people who are better. When I was in office, I was certainly not the best but God in His wisdom and in His majesty decided for whatever reason to prop me up.

I think the only way you can honour God is to do that which at the end of the day will be pleasing to him after all, these things are temporary, you will return someday back to your creator.

 

Sir, if you observe the sets of governors between 1999 and 2003, you could say that many of them respected the principle of separation of powers. But things happened along the line when the presidency sponsored the impeachment of governors; ministers are appointed specifically to empower them to go and challenge the governors. When you consider these things, don’t you think the governors are justified in doing some of these things they’re doing?

Maybe, maybe not. But for me, I look at it differently. Again, what I am saying is that if God in His divinity made you a governor, I mean among all those who contested, you emerged the governor, without Him you could not have emerged, so who else do you fear?

 

So, a governor should ignore all those signs?

No, no, no. For me, the laws are there, they provide for when somebody needs to be called to order, you know. You have your support; you have your party. There must be a meeting point with all the heads, so that if you are going wrong, your attention will be drawn to it. I’m talking about people who God gave them grace and the enablement to be where they are, suddenly metamorphosing into something else. When I was there, 

I had a policy, my friends come into my bedroom they can have access because they are the ones that could tell you what is happening out there.

But you see, in the system that we have, they want people who will blow their trumpets. these are the people that parade the corridors of power, and if you dare offer anything contrary to what they want to hear, you are branded an enemy.

It may surprise you to hear for instance, that since I got into APC, up to this date, I’ve not sat one-on-one with President Tinubu. I’ve not met him. If he sees me today, he wouldn’t know me. But because I believe in his presidency with Kashim Shettima. I believe we’ll be getting somewhere. It doesn’t bother me whether I know him personally or not.

 

Talking about Tinubu, recently, he had to go to the Supreme Court to liberate the local government from the firm grip of governors. 

In theory, the framers of the constitution conceived a situation where governance at the local level would be the best for majority of our citizens, but in practice, it hasn’t been so because truly, we all know that the power of controlling money is vested in the governors, they could exploit it.

You have election in a particular state and the ruling party will return 100 percent. There’s no way the governor would say, go and contest as chairman in a local government, that you will fail since the instruments that propel this are in his hands. So, given that situation, it is clear that something was wrong. Again funds that ought to accrue to them as a tier of government is alleged not to have been accruing to them.

Frankly, I tell you, when I was the governor, I didn’t even know what any local government was receiving, it is not my business.

 

Was it because the joint account was not there?  

Joint account or no joint account, the governor still calls the shot but with this Supreme Court judgment it won’t be the same. I salute President Tinubu on this one. This is a radical, out of the box thinking that ought to propel this country to the next level because what it has done is explore the available avenues, get a judgment, free the local governments for them to receive money directly.

Now, the consequential thing I will now ask His Excellency the President to do is to ensure that this judgment translates by virtue of amendment of the constitution, amending Section 7 and any other enabling section so that this decision of the Supreme Court is reflected therein, so that it becomes sacrosanct.

 

Some will say this triumph at the Supreme Court is just an academic exercise, because behind the scene, the governors still decide whatever happens.  

That is one step in freeing the local governments. I think the next step that Mr. President must do is therefore to secure complete freedom for the local government by ensuring that INEC conducts the elections into the local government.

 

You are saying they should scrap the state electoral commissions?

Absolutely. Believe me, by the time we do that, you will now see democracy in action, because you can be in party A, I can be in party B, and we can still go and canvass and win our election.That will go a long, long way in in fact, establishing and giving more impetus to democracy at the local government level.

 

Some are calling for the establishment of another body to conduct local government elections.

No, no, no. We can’t afford this. We can’t spend money duplicating functions. INEC can do this, why must we create another body to do this?

 

But even elections conducted by INEC have not been hitch-free. 

They will still be better. This democracy is a work in progress.

 

Are you suggesting the Constitution should also be amended to give local government chairmen protection from governors?

No, no. I don’t think we should extend this thing that far. Allow the councils to make their mistakes. There is a chairman, vice chairman, and councillors, elected councillors.

If at any point they decide that the chairman is misbehaving, they should have the power to remove him. 

 

In the Second Republic, there was party supremacy, where the governor submits to the chairman of the party, the president submits to the national chairman of the party. This is no longer practiced,  is that not one of the problems?

Absolutely.

 

What do you think can be done?

Well, again, it’s, let’s go back to the good old days…

 

Power to the political parties?

Yes, let’s go back to the good old days, not only power to the political parties, but also to ensure that those who man all these things are people that have the fear of God. They will do the needful, you know. This thing about power is transient. Today you are there, tomorrow you are no more there. Why don’t you endeavour to leave a legacy? If you’re a party chairman, must you whittle down; must you crush somebody just because you want to be a chairman of a party? You know, it’s all mindset.

 

What is your view about this governor’s forum because that has added even more powers to the governor at the national level, checkmating the president. I remember when Okonjo-Iweala was there, she suggested this Sovereign Wealth Fund and the governors through their  chairman  rejected?

Anything that will help the country to come to terms with its challenges and move forward should be accepted. But if it is just for the mere act of opposing the president or anybody, I don’t subscribe to that. Coming to talk about Sovereign Wealth, I remember very well, as a deputy governor, Okonjo-Iweala would come and say, look, this is the way forward. 

When she was saying, let’s save excess crude, let’s save the excess funds for a rainy day. 

The governors, 90% of them opposed it. They said there is no provision for that in the Constitution. Let’s share, let’s share, that is all.

You know, the real beginning of a move forward is that we must have a mind reset. Think about Nigeria first and not our individual selves. If we do that, if we had followed what she had told us, our naira wouldn’t be where it is today.

And people are blaming, heaping blames, you know. In fact, the tragedy of it today is that eight years have gone. So many things happened. Already that is already forgotten.

 

You are making reference to the commencement of the APC government.

We are now only hammering on what this president is doing that is wrong. What about all those things that were done?

I mean, honestly, I tell you, President Buhari as a person, was a wonderful person. In fact, in my university days, I literally saw him as an angel. And until the last time he left, I had high respect for him.

But look at the damage that was done in the last eight years. Go around Abuja everywhere, estates, estates. I keep on wondering, where are these people getting this money? 

And somebody told me, the money is now coming up, from the last eight years. They are investing it into estates and whereas you and me are battling, to see how we pay our children’s school fees. Is that fair?

 

It now looks as if you are not a former governor in this country, that you cannot become anything. We have a situation now, both the president and the vice president are former governors so also during the time of YarAdua, Jonathan etc Is it deliberate? 

No, no. If it was, I should have been in government. I tried to contest Senate but when the delegates demanded for N1 million each,  I said, I can’t afford it.They said, sorry, sir, you are the best candidate, but honestly, there’s one more million waiting for us from another. So it’s not all governors, sir.

 

Is it that you don’t have up to that as a former governor?

God is my witness. I don’t fear man. I fear God to whom I will account for my life in the hereafter.

 

And you didn’t go to your colleagues in the Governors forum?

To do what? In fact, the problem I have is, in all fairness, when we were in government, like the person of the Senate president, you know, he was somebody who we could access, he helped us, some of us who were deputy governors, he helped us.

And a number of them, like the chief servant Babangida, from time to time, , if we go to occasion, they will say look we know what is happening, they will give us, you know some support.

 

You have been both deputy governor and a governor. Why do governors find it difficult to support their deputies to succeed them?  

Honestly, I don’t know. I have asked myself this question. I don’t know. But happily, I ended very well with my boss. By divine arrangement, somehow, I became a governor. It was not as if he was opposed to me. We still relate very well. I visit him.

But it’s not all people that have gotten the experience I got. He was a father figure, we related very well. I thank him for giving me the opportunity. Perhaps if I’d continue with my practice, I would have ended up at least maybe a senior advocate or gone to the Supreme Court because that’s where my colleagues are.

But I think if I had the opportunity to pick my deputy, believe me, I would have done the needful. There can be nobody else who is better than you to take over from me.

But somehow, I don’t know why it doesn’t work in Nigeria, it’s the Nigerian factor. They say it is the Nigerian factor, I mean distrust comes in and all that. I believe that as the years go by and our democracy matures, this thing will become non-issue.