‘Oil in the sea can never belong to FG’

What do you think the national conference will achieve?What we from Southern Nigeria and South-South in particular, what will interest us I can tell you is some power devolution and an acceptable revenue arrangement. Fiscal federalism where people can, and should be in a position to control resources within their own states of origin. That […]

What do you think the national conference will achieve?
What we from Southern Nigeria and South-South in particular, what will interest us I can tell you is some power devolution and an acceptable revenue arrangement. Fiscal federalism where people can, and should be in a position to control resources within their own states of origin. That is the interest of my people; some form of federalism, some form of practical federalism because if we go back and continue business as usual, it won’t take Nigeria to Point B. we have been marking time on Point A because we are trying to be respectful to people, we need to work a little harder. The time for that type of respect has gone; the truth has to be said.
This cap in hand at the end of every month for states to go to the Federal Government to get money is not speaking for integrity and respect for states, it is not speaking for independence of states. That is why states cannot really bite; they can bark but they can’t bite because they need money at the end of the month and the money is coming from oil, oil, oil and gas from the South, from Rivers State, Bayelsa, Ondo and so on.
But what we are saying is every state should exist but let there be some level of economic independence for these states so that there will be some respect for leadership of the states. Government of the federation should go in now and find a way of exploiting the resources that abound in Nigerian soil and sea. No state is barren; every state in Nigeria has some deposits of natural resources. We should go back to land, people should go back to farm; farming should be brought back as a culture, farming of groundnut, cocoa, palm oil and palm kernel. We should go back, let the resources of Nigeria be multiplied. These are issues that are bringing down the nation, and that is what we are saying.
It seems that every delegate agrees that there is need for devolution of powers, but a point of departure is in revenue sharing. One example is the controversy surrounding the abolition of the onshore/offshore dichotomy. How do you push your case for the retention of the abolition?
 Let me tell you something and it is important that you know this. Historically, Nigeria started oil work from 1946. There were earlier attempts, 1908, 1903; there were earlier organisations; Nigerian Bitumen Company that started oil in 1908, nothing happened until 1946 when Shell and BP put their resources together and started oil exploration in 1946. It took 10 years for oil to be found in commercial quantity and quality in Oloibiri in 1956.
It is important for you to know that since the finding of oil, it has been like a curse to Nigeria. All the other aspects of our lives that generated income that sustained this country before, have been abandoned and we are saying it is wrong. People should not close their eyes to the resources they are sitting on. Let there be further input by Federal Government; I wouldn’t mind, let the money come from wherever it is coming from to go in and make sure that each state is economically independent. It is very important.
In the area of dichotomy, what do you call dichotomy? Now listen, if you don’t live by the coasts, you cannot claim coastal area. You must live within the coasts; Nigeria has coastal area because of the coastal states that are inside Nigeria. If those coastal states should disappear, Nigeria will be a landlocked nation. Therefore, you cannot, I repeat, you cannot treat them with just bare hands.
You must know that the amalgamation of 1914, the Independence of 1960, Republic of 1963 were all agreements based on the existing entities of nations that formed Nigeria. We have agreed that we are here; indivisible country, fine, with a country map that cannot be touched, fine; but does it mean that ethnicities, the ethnic groups that live in Nigeria who have their own opinions, should it be ignored? I think not and you must listen to them. You cannot tell me that you would have a right to the oil in the sea and that oil is Federal Government oil; no, it cannot be.
The 200 nautical miles space that is allowed as what people call continental shelf is not bound to be if there are no coastal states. You cannot play ball on top of water. I am living here and there is an elongation of water  as a result of rainfall or flooding, are you saying that that part of the state is no longer owned by that state, it is now Federal Government just because it is covered by water?  The water seaward is part of the state that has the coastal boundary. That is what we are saying and it has to stand that way.
A potential source of conflict is the issue of derivation; oil producing states are asking for more, other people are asking for a reduction of…
(Cuts in)…there can’t be a reduction, the constitution is clear that the oil producing states should have a minimum, not maximum, a minimum of 13 percent. Nobody should get themselves confused by possible constitutional arrangement. The constitution we operate today says a minimum of 13 percent. It can only go up; it cannot come down and if people begin to count, oh, we have ministry of Niger Delta, we have NDDC, we have this, we don’t have that; look at the funding.
Look at the funding of the NDDC, look at the funding of the ministry of the Niger Delta. Last two years they did no other job, no other external contract order than East-West Road. Is East-West Road only Rivers State’s and oil producing states’ road? These are national carriageways; it is not to the benefit of Niger Delta alone, no, no, no. Ministry of Niger Delta is not for Niger Delta people, they just gave that name. It could have been ministry of works. The roads are East-West Road they did throughout two to three years now. To do those roads, people don’t sit down in Abuja and begin to speculate cost. The cost of doing any road here is less than 10 percent when you want to do roads in southern Nigeria, in the Niger Delta. It is a difficult assignment. The terrain is something else. Then you talk about the NDDC. How is the NDDC funded? Who are the major contractors in NDDC? Are they Rivers State people, are they Bayelsa people? The answer is no; they are Nigerians. The control of NDDC is in Abuja. So, there is really nothing that is coming to us exclusively as Niger Deltans that we can say is our own. NDDC jobs are not held by just the Niger Deltans, it’s all over Nigeria.
There is this accusation that people from your side have been unable to manage the money that the get?
It is a different matter altogether; management of funds you are given is not only restricted to the people of the Niger Delta. Every single part of Nigeria is given some forms of money; they should be ready to account for it. We are not talking about accountability. Yes, there may be some misgivings, there may be some inappropriate application of public funds, I agree. But that is not fundamental; what is fundamental is the quantum of cash that is deployed back to the area for restitutions.  Do you know the environmental problem we have there? Do you know some people in Ogoni land, let me just use them as an example, do not know which is day or night due to flaring of gas; there is light 24 hours. The level of illness there; eye problems, you cannot quantify with any amount of money. Which section of Nigeria will agree that that will happen to him and he will have nothing for it? Nobody!
Most people point at mismanagement of resources for all these
I don’t think it is mismanagement. I think it is lack of adequate funding. That is my own assertion; it is lack of adequate funding.
There are suspicions from certain quarters that this national conference is a cover for the elongation of president Goodluck Jonathan’s government with support from his people in southern Nigeria.
I don’t think so. I can tell you from all the position of authority that I know, there is nothing like that on the table. I am really shocked to hear this from you because I know Jonathan does not have any personal agenda about this matter. Jonathan is reacting purely on what Nigerians are saying that things are not going well. That is why he said discuss all; he didn’t say go and discuss elections only. He said discuss everything. I don’t think there is any, any, I repeat, I don’t think that southern Nigerians are planning for power elongation for Mr. President; no.
We go for the second and final term of four years and that is the end of the matter. Whoever would benefit from whatever constitutional arrangement that would be made in the National Assembly, it is a different thing altogether. We are not interested in bastardising Nigeria’s constitution because our son is a president; I think it is not in our agenda.
You have been very active at plenary on how Nigeria will reduce dependence on oil and exploit other sources of revenue. Do you have a presentation on how that can be achieved?
 Time is too short but we are trying to put something together. As a member of the committee on revenue what we are saying there is that we should be able to find a way to close the gaps. There are too many gaps now in our revenue sourcing. Government is not really collecting all that it is supposed to collect. As at today, nobody can give us authoritatively how much oil is produced and how much oil is exported. We think in our committee that is a gross loss of income for Nigeria. We also believe that the various committees dealing with natural resources should go deeper with us to ensure that every state that has a deposit of natural resources should be exploited. Federal Government should be encouraged to invest so that they can get more money from those states and those states can remain independent. That is our ambition; it could be tall, it could be short, it could be medium but we think that would increase the power of the states and also the Federal Government revenue base.
Briefly itemise what your people want to see at the end of this conference.
 We want to ensure at the end of the day that there is power devolution. There is too much power in the hands of the Federal Government. My people also are saying that the federating units should be states; some people are saying regions, some people are saying political geographical zones, my people in Rivers State are saying states should be federating units because nobody can diminish the states. All you can do now is to increase states.