PDP is heading for collapse –Nuhu Ribadu

Your presidential ambition is no longer a matter of speculation. When will you formally declare and on what political platform? My intention, first, is to join a political party and I intend to do so next Monday, October 18. I intend to my State (Adamawa) to pick the membership card of the Action Congress of […]

Your presidential ambition is no longer a matter of speculation. When will you formally declare and on what political platform?

My intention, first, is to join a political party and I intend to do so next Monday, October 18. I intend to my State (Adamawa) to pick the membership card of the Action Congress of Nigeria (ACN). ACN is a new party in Nigeria today; it is a party coming out of a coalition of other parties into one. It is also a fresh party; a new one that is giving Nigeria hope at the moment.

People describe you as somebody who is far away from the grassroots. How do you intend to reach out to the electorate at the grassroots in order to actualise your ambition?

I am not too far away from the grassroots. I am probably more connected to the ordinary Nigerian than all the other presidential aspirants. I am from a political family. I was born into a family of politicians. I grew up to be surrounded by politicians. Ribadu is synonymous with politics right at the beginning of this country. So I have never been far away from the grassroots; I have always been connected with ordinary people. I can, therefore comfortably claim that I have never been far away from ordinary Nigerians. Indeed, my entire life has been motivated by the struggle to improve the lives of my people, especially the less privileged and the vulnerable. Maybe what is new is party politics which, like I earlier said, I am going to join a political party on Monday.

There are others who are aspiring to rule Nigeria come 2011. What makes Nuhu Ribadu stand out among the other presidential aspirants?

There are wonderful and amazing people who are contesting but politics is about the choice of the people. I wouldn’t want to say I am outstanding, exceptional or better than any of them. But I believe I have something to offer; I believe that time calls for an individual like me today because Nigeria is in a moment of change. I believe that fifty years is a golden period that requires something fresh to start; something new and I fit in perfectly with that. I believe I am the product of a true Nigeria that we always dreamt of. A Nigeria that our forefathers dreamt of and wanted to see their dreams actualised.

I am a true Nigerian free of all afflictions. I am also a modern person who understands Nigeria and Nigerians. I can fit in with modernity perfectly. I believe that with my experience and what I have done for this country, I am most qualified and what am I talking about? I am talking about my twenty five years of experience in the public service. I don’t know anything other than to serve my country, Nigeria. I went to the Ahmadu Bello University and read law, proceeded to the law school and passed my bar examination. I did my NYSC and from that year 1984, I have been in public office until in the past one year or two.

As a Lawyer I decided to join the Nigeria Police Force and worked in some of the most difficult areas. I considered it as community work; public service.  I was a prosecutor for over twelve years and later rose to head the legal department.  Equally had the chance to head the EFCC from the scratch where I confronted and fought corruption. For the first time in the history of Nigeria, there were results in fighting corruption. There were convictions by regular courts of law. We also for the first time, recovered billions and billions of naira. For example ,we were able to raise our reserve from less than $7 billion in 2003 to over $60 billion in 2007, in addition to getting the entire debt of Nigeria wiped out. In that capacity, I contributed my own bid towards the development of our society and believe I can do more if given the opportunity to serve as president of this country.

 

Talking about Nigeria’s foreign debt that you talked about, how do you feel that in spite of the over $18 billion relief granted, the country is yet to experience appreciable measure of economic revival?

Indeed, that is the sad aspect of it. But you know, when you pay your debts, should all celebrate it; you know what debt means even as an individual. If it is hanging on you, it will always be there and the earlier you get it off you the better for you. Nigeria is not a poor country and no time will come when anybody will say you, can forget it and continue. We are not going to be like Somalia where the world would say you are not good enough therefore you are an exception; it would never happen. If you follow the history of our foreign debts, you discover that in the early eighties it was less than $10 billion from where it started growing. At the time we cleared it was over $34 billion and if we didn’t get the relief at that time, probably it would have gone to over $40 billion. So, it is very important for you to get out of debts; it enables you to start afresh and do business with the world and also get foreign direct investment. Any country with the kind of hangover like our own is rated terribly poor which is not a good thing. But like you rightly pointed out, it is sad that in spite of the relief, we are yet to witness appreciable economic growth and development.

Now that you have joined partisan politics, one would have expected that having served under the PDP government and participated in the economic team, you would pitch tent with the PDP…

(Cuts in) It is impossible for me to be in the PDP; at least not the type of PDP that we have in our country today. The party has been extremely unfair to Nigerians and I would certainly not be part of that. Of course, I can tell you that not everybody in the PDP is bad and every opportunity I have I will tell the good ones to get out of the party because it is heading for collapse. PDP is a collection of people who have taken care of themselves and forgotten about the rest of Nigerians; a collection of people who have gotten so rich while the rest of us wallow in poverty. I totally disagree with them because they do not have policies, they do not have plans and programmes. Therefore, I wouldn’t want to be part of that.

If you become the president of the country, what programme of action would you put in place to correct the imperfections of the PDP government that you have talked about?

I can confidently tell you that I do plan to change this country positively. I would face the challenges confronting our people. First of all I will confront the problem of poverty because our people are poor. In the midst of plenty, so many people are struggling to survive in this country. This is not right; it is not fair because only a few are enjoying in a country that has plenty. So we will make sure we confront poverty by making sure that we provide the basics like electricity within the shortest time possible.

I know the reason why we have not been able to do it well and why it failed. Since 1990, we have not been able to properly invest in the electricity sector; we only ended up having people who were busy stealing left, right and centre in the power sector. When we even started putting in money, we did it in the wrong way; selfish interest did not allow us to do it very well and I know in details everybody who was involved in this.

So, I am in a better position to solve this problem because I know the root cause. Secondly, I will work towards ensuring that government at all tiers perform because it is the responsibility of the federal government to ensure that the money belonging to the Nigerian people is used judiciously.

If it is used judiciously, Nigerians will get their basic needs. I do intend also to stop corruption. I will stop corruption not just at the federal level but even in the private sector because it is destroying us and making it impossible to move forward. I can tell you that in my government, institutions like the Police and Customs as well as Immigration will not only work, they will deliver. I will do it because I intend to be honest, transparent and accountable and to make sure that I am not corrupt and nobody would be corrupt around me.

There would be zero tolerance on corruption in my government. Armed robbery would also be a thing of the past if Nuhu Ribadu is the President of Nigeria. Violent crimes will stop, kidnappings will stop and bombings will be a thing of the past. I can assure you that Nigerians will sleep with their two eyes closed. But the details of my economic blueprint will come out when I formally declare my intention.

Do you have a conviction that next year’s elections would take place successfully? We ask this question because we have an INEC that keeps making requests that if we don’t get this or that the elections would be affected.

I am an optimist by nature and I do look at things positively. I also believe that there is a change in our country. I think time has come for us to have a free and fair elections in Nigeria and nobody can stop it. It is not just in Nigeria; the trend is now everywhere in the world. All these debate going on now is an indication that Nigeria is changing. I also have confidence in the leadership that is driving the electoral process and I think this is also new in our country. But like I say, the most important people in the process are Nigerians who are demanding free and fair elections and I believe the world itself would no longer tolerate irresponsible ways of producing leaders. I have also seen a change in the mood of the beneficiaries of election rigging; most of them are embarrassed because they are not really happy people. So I believe we are going to have a free and fair elections come 2011 but we are going to fight for it by insisting that the votes of our people count.

 

You were removed from the EFCC, barred from convocating at NIPPS and dismissed from the Nigeria Police; to what extent would you say you have forgiven the past?

Alhamdulillahi, God has made me in such a way that I don’t hold people in mind. I know that it is God’s wish that certain things happen. That is why the very first day that I returned to this country, I went the next day to greet the family of Umaru Yar’adua. I visited his family; I greeted his wife and his mother. That tells you who Nuhu Ribadu is.  The late Yar’adua was the head of the government that did that to me. I have no place for hatred in my mind; I have no time to waste holding anything bad against anyone. I believed that is God’s wish that those things happen and it is God’s wish that I am here again with the possibility and chance to contribute again to the development of my country. I am a very grateful person; grateful to Almighty Allah. I have no time to look back and hold anybody responsible for those things that happened to me. I will be doing the greatest disservice to myself if I do the contrary.

While you were in exile, Gani Fawehenmi died and somehow you came in for his burial and it became an issue; how did you sneak in and out of the country?

Yes I came in and it is because I have strong principles on certain issues in life. Gani was exceptionally good not just to Nuhu Ribadu but to the country. I met him the first time when we were trying politicians of the second republic. I was part of the process. I was working in General Tunde Idiagbon’s office as an NYSC member. In that capacity, I had a chance to relate to the Special Investigation Panellists [SIPs] that investigated the politicians of the second republic and also attempted tp bring them to justice through the military tribunals. So I met Gani who impressed me from the very time we met.

He was the only lawyer who did not boycott the tribunals that time, and he did that on the basis of his principles. Then after I had joined the police, I had cause to interact with him. I found him an extremely honest person; a detribalised Nigerian and a very courageous man who stood for justice. Even while I was in the EFCC, I consulted Gani regularly. In fact, I did some of the most difficult things that I did at the commission on the basis of the wisdom I acquired from Gani. He helped me through the job. But he was not the only one. There were several other people who I have this kind of respect for.

If Sunday Awoniyi had died while I was out of the country, I probably would have come back because I also hold him in the same high esteem. If Yahaya Gusau had died at that time, I would have probably come back as well; the same thing applies to Bala Usman and Dr Suleiman Kumo. All these people died while I was here and I attended there burial. There are people I respect like that and Gani is one of them. So I did not want to miss that opportunity to stand by his grave or body and pray for him and bid him farewell. That was too strong for me to neglect therefore I decided to come.  I prayed God to protect me and God protected me. I came in, stayed, did what I did and left.

But you knew you were to be arrested. Did you plan the trip to evade that or you just prayed and came in?

Of course I was not careless; I did not just jump in. You may be shocked and surprised to know that the law enforcement agents celebrated when they saw me at the point of entry; they wanted to take me up. I just didn’t want to put people in trouble that time…all of them were very happy when they saw me; I did not see anyone who showed sign of anger or contempt towards me. In fact they were abusing the people in authority that time; they were saying don’t mind them, God will do this, God will do that. So I was fully protected by the people there. It’s amazing you know; Nigerians know the good; they know what is going on and a lot of them didn’t buy that thing…I have seen it all. I was in the police and I know how it works and I knew I was almost like a target of attack…But I came without any iota of doubt that I needed to come and do what I did. Like I said, I have my principles which are very strong; if I believe in something  I do them without fear because I only fear God.

Didn’t your coming in amount to security breach?

In what way, so I committed an offence by coming to my country? [Laughter…]. Do you know that up till now nobody has told me what I did wrong?

They said you didn’t declare your assets….

…Which is unbelievable. It’s amazing that when you cannot establish anything against someone you go to that extent. They have my asset declaration forms with them. But what happened was that they thought I would be crazy enough to come back to Nigeria and start showing my asset declaration… and be saying no, I have declared. There is no way you can be the chairman of EFCC without declaring your assets, it’s not possible. You must go before the senate to be cleared and there is no way you can appear before the senate without declaring your assets. So it’s very funny. I ran the EFCC for five years and they were surprised that they could not get anything that I did wrong. Isn’t that amazing? So I am very grateful to God. But in any case, asset declaration is not a criminal offence. You cannot sentence someone to prison for not declaring his assets. There is nowhere in the laws that say you can be imprisoned for failing to declare your assets.

 

Since you claimed you did nothing wrong, how do you react to the pardon extended to you?

Pardon for what? They can never claim that they have given me any pardon. What have I done? What offence have I committed? I am even waiting to be told what I have done to be retired from the Nigeria Police Force. The PDP government dismissed me before and then reduced it to retirement. I feel that is a punishment because I am yet to be told what I have done for me to be retired. I had put in 25 years of service to my country but I was stopped abruptly through retirement. I am aware that retirement in civil service is punishment and I am not yet told what I have done to be retired. Was it [the retirement] for doing what I believed was the right thing for my country? And some people would say they have pardoned me, for what? You punish me and you turn around to pardon me? I have been retired by this government for reasons I don’t know.

Will you also challenge that in court?

No I won’t. People who do the right thing and have not committed any offence and have not breached any known law should not be punished. It has happened to me but I will say let it not happen to others. It is not a good thing for our country.

Some people think Nuhu Ribadu has come to work for Jonathan. How do you feel when you hear that?

That’s the shocking thing; come to work for a government that retired me, for what? Today I am a free person. Perhaps before I was a civil servant, therefore I had no choice but to work for the federal government controlled by PDP. But as a free person I will never be part of PDP, not until God has changed PDP. Nothing is important to me in life as what is right, just and fair. I am not after money; I am not after power or abuse of it. For me, power is about opportunity for you to do what is right. Today, I have a free choice to be wherever I want to be and it is my choice to be where I am today [ACN].

You said several times and many people believed you that you never took bribe; and you also said you are not rich. But knowing that such a project that you are undertaking now in Nigeria is capital intensive, where are you getting the money to finance the campaign?

To be honest, you don’t have to be rich to do that. There are many people who were never rich but they joined politics and did very well, and even better than the rich ones. Shehu Shagari was never rich but he was elected president. General Buhari is not rich but is an honest person. He has been in politics since 2003; he contested twice and arguably even won. So Nuhu Ribadu is not rich but he will make it. One amazing thing is that money can never buy you name, which is the most important ingredient that a politician requires and I have worked so hard in my life for that.

Is the EFCC of today the EFCC of your dream?

This is a difficult one. I have always said that I didn’t want to comment on the EFCC simply because I am the immediate past chairman, so you don’t expect that what I say will help anything. I think it will be fair to give time or leave Nigerians who watch things to make comments, not someone like me. This is because people are likely to misunderstand me and even say it is because I was removed. So for that, I want to save myself from that.