Responsible governance, not immunity is what we need – JB Daudu
In view of current developments regarding the arraignment of the Senate president, would you recommend immunity for top officials of the National Assembly? I have never been an advocate of immunity but an advocate of responsible governance. If public officials are responsible, we would have no need for immunity clauses. These clauses were put there […]
In view of current developments regarding the arraignment of the Senate president, would you recommend immunity for top officials of the National Assembly?
I have never been an advocate of immunity but an advocate of responsible governance. If public officials are responsible, we would have no need for immunity clauses. These clauses were put there to check the misuse of executive authority, like witch-hunting and character assassination of weaker public officials by stronger public officials. Providing immunity is not the answer to such abuse of power. If we put in immunity today and in the future we have irresponsible areas that require that you don’t have immunity then we start canvassing for the removal? Therefore, we have to understand that it is not the personality who runs it at the moment but ensuring that the system stands up to such periodic aberration.
Economic recession is a reality in the country now, will you also say we are having rule of law recession in the country?
It depends on every individual’s judgment but as far as I am concerned the present administration apparently has its own style and this is not in consonance with due process in the rule of law. This is unfortunate, but it is what to be expected. I do not subscribe to the view that you should suspend basic fundamental rights, due process and rule of law merely because you are fighting corruption. In every society, even in the most advanced societies democratically, you still have people who are corrupt. It is the institution that needs to be strengthened through the rule of law so that you can curb the excesses of a few people who are deviant.
To answer the question, of course there is a clear abuse of rules and due process by agencies and government and the buck has to stop somewhere. And if where the buck stops is not taking steps to ensure that the constitution is obeyed in the manner which we understand it; or that the organs of government saddled with the responsibility of interpreting the constitution are being subjected to a barrage of assault which will effectually institutionally weaken them and make them not to function as intended by the constitution, at the end of the day, that will boomerang again on all the arms of government that are playing with that kind of fire.
Do you think the DSS should have referred to the CJN before the raids on the judges were conducted?
No, that’s not the issue. I have read Section 214 of the constitution that says there shall be only one police force in Nigeria and I don’t think the DSS is the police force. They are an agency set up to gather intelligence and protect this country from insurgency, terrorism, religious conflagration and prevent the occurrence of coup d’état. Ordinarily, the DSS should have all agencies of government like Air force, the police embedded in its system so that when in the course of its investigation, there is need for the work of the police force, the police embedded in it can do this activity but acting in the name and authority of the police.
Now the judiciary that is to decide whether the DSS is a proper police force or not is the one being charged left, right and centre. So whatever the decision the judiciary gives would be taken to be a decision either in fear or in defense of themselves. You don’t push your institutions to that extent. If you have clear evidence against a judicial officer, there are civilized ways of going about it. Call the officer(s), the head of court and show them the evidence and I am sure such officer(s) will resign. If they don’t resign, then you take that step that you want to take against them.
The DSS has been likened to the Federal Bureau Investigation (FBI) of the United States in purpose of establishment, functions and mode of operation. What is your view on this?
You can’t liken the DSS with the FBI when the Constitution of USA is different from that of Nigeria. The DSS is an intelligence gathering arm of the government so as to feed the other agencies with intelligence so that they can move and prevent insurgency. You can walk in and out of the FBI’s office, but can you walk into the DSS’ office like that? You can go to the FBI’s office and lodge a complaint as if you are entering a normal police station. And America’s constitution allows several units of police force. Before, DSS operatives did not wear uniform, who approved to them to be wearing uniform? So, if there is a problem with the police, let’s disband it and replace it with the DSS and let’s see whether in five years’ time the DSS will survive as the police have survived.
The outgoing CJN threw a challenge that senior lawyers who know corrupt judges should come forward and name them, and as at now there is no record of anyone that has come out.
This is because they don’t know. We suspect that a judge is corrupt when if he gives his judgment and he turns the law upside down, that is an incidence of corruption. We all know the law. If today you say A and tomorrow you cannot be consistent and you change your judgment to become B, that is an incidence of corruption. If the CJN wants us to give him a list starting from their court, the Supreme Court of inconsistent judgment and decisions that stand reason on his side, to me that is the way you can know who is a corrupt judge, to know by another way, then you must be an accomplice.
How about cases like that of Rickey Tarfa, a senior advocate who is facing charges of corruption?
No. He is presumed innocent until proven guilty and those kinds of ridiculous charges cannot stand the test of time. I have judges who have been my friends from childhood. Peradventure, such a judge comes to a financial problem and I assist him, am I bribing a judge? We have to be careful in this country how we damage institutions.
NBA in one breath said the judiciary is being cowed by the executive and in another breath they asked the affected judges to step aside. As a former president of the association, don’t you see this as a contradiction?
No, it is not but I agree with Chief Olanipekun’s position that you should appear to be consistent. The NBA took the right decision when it said that the raiding of judges’ houses and the manner in which they were brought into limelight went against all civilized norms of approaching that kind of situation, and also the people who carried out the operation should not have been the ones to carry out the operation in my understanding of the Nigeria’s Constitution. If you have evidence against people, catch them while they are collecting the bribes. If you cannot catch them at that point, it becomes a disciplinary issue. It is all speculation to say you found money in someone’s house. You go to someone’s house at 1.00a.m., we don’t even know if the monies were planted. This was my first impulse.
The call that the judges affected to step aside is premature. There is a presumption that they are innocent until proven guilty. Calling for them to step aside is to expose the inner intention which is to step away from their work. If you take a man away from his work for five years and at the end he was acquitted, how does he return back to his work? There is no reason at all for them to step aside. But when they are charged to court, their employer can ask them to step aside. This is what the public service rules say.
For the justices that have stepped aside, they should have just resigned if they felt they have done something wrong or they felt that when lawyers come to appear before them they look tainted.
With recent developments, the call for the creation of special courts to try corruption and terrorism cases seems to be on the rise. What is your take on this?
Absolutely no. Special courts mean courts that other people can manipulate. That in itself is corruption. Every organization must abide by the decision of the court. If we have a corrupt judicial system, it is because that is what we deserve to get. It is because there is corruption virtually everywhere. You can’t have a corrupt judicial system in isolation where everywhere else is clean.